Mallard (Sound Fitted) Discontinued

[RB51]

46 minutes ago, ukpetey said:

would prefer it to have been done for me. I pay for the convenience!

 

12 minutes ago, dBerriff said:

I would rather buy sound fitted. My eyesight is not what it used to be

Ditto for me also. R-

[Rallymatt]

1 hour ago, dBerriff said:

A pre-war A4 with full valences. Now that is the classic “Buggati” look. LNER blue too.  For me, this is the best looking of the UK streamliners.

For anyone new to all this the A4 streamlining was inspired by the lines of Bugatti cars. 

 To expand on this, the A4 streamlining wasn’t inspired by Bugatti cars, it was refined in the Bugatti wind tunnel. Gresley sent models of the A4 design to the Bugatti factory where they built planes and had one of the first wind tunnels. The main issue to resolve was to get steam and smoke to rise up and along the length of the locomotive, initially it was obscuring cab view and was limiting its potential speed, driver/fireman couldn’t see signals. This sounds like the thing of Hollywood but the fix was due to mishandling of the test model resulting in a thumb press in the clay at the rear of the chimney, it was an accident. Other tweaks to the shape followed once engineers realised indentations and certain shapes could have profound effects on the aerodynamic efficiency. Testing of an A4 in a modern wind tunnel has astonished leading experts at just how effective the design was from so long ago. 😁

[dBerriff]

I was wrong but according to OS Knock, British Locomotives Vol. 2, the design was inspired by Bugatti railcars (Paris-Deauville line) and Bulleid (then Chief Assistant to Gresley) devised the aerofoil shape of the running plate and valences. The result, in my opinion, was the best looking locomotive ever built. 

The wind-tunnel tests are attributed to the National Physical Laboratory and the streamlining saved 138 horsepower at 90 mph. 

So that is what Knock has to say and I apologise for leaving rail off railcar. 

Edited July 12 by dBerriff

[dBerriff]

And I am getting forgetful in my dotage as Mallard is already available in TT:120 in this format. 🤐

[Rallymatt]

There was more recent research done on the origins of the A4 design and the input of Bugatti was found to quite a bit more than the press of the day were told. What I didn’t expect was the amount of collaboration that took place between chief mechanical engineers of the big 4, they shared ideas at dinners of Institute of Mechanical Engineers on a regular basis. Bugatti was obsessed with aerodynamics and developed the most advanced testing techniques for the era and welcomed Gresley. I think the idea of a Frenchman with an Italian Aero company was too much for the British Empire to accept 🤣

[dBerriff]

Thank you for the update. My library is admittedly quite old (decades) now and Knock was more interested in performance than the technical side. 

[Rallymatt]

Maybe I am biased but, I think the battle between the big 4 (well 3) to claim the speed record and the real stories is one of the epic tales that would make a great film. For its era, it was like going to the moon! And they made a few films about that 😁

 

[Silver Fox 17]

3 minutes ago, Rallymatt said:

 For its era, it was like going to the moon! And they made a few films about that 😁

 

But was that real?

We know from records etc about speeds (I would just use 2 LNER and LMS) so that is fact, but, a lot of speculation arrises about the moon lol

[Rallymatt]

Garry, don’t go there! 🤣 My personal proof of the moon landing in ‘68 is the fact the Russians didn’t say it was a fake. They had so many spies all over the project they would have called it out and dined out on the political capital for decades. 
The stunning thing about train speeds is only 16 years after Mallard at 126mph,  the French were over 200mph with their BB and CC electrics, there is a superb film of one of those test runs in ‘54 and the ballast is being fired up like cannon balls from the wake! 

[dBerriff]

It might have been downhill and it wrecked the centre big-end, but what was it like on the footplate of Mallard at over 120 mph? Or in the dynamometer car?  No computer optimised track and wheel profiles, or advanced suspension. But, I bet all of us on here would give anything to have been there. 

[Rallymatt]

I have a feeling the experience would have been unforgettable 

[LTSR_NSE]

Certainly not for the poor fireman! 😉

[Tim Allen]

6 hours ago, LTSR_NSE said:

Certainly not for the poor fireman! 😉

Some say, after the shift he had arms like Popeye.

In all seriousness it makes my back ache just thinking of the shovelling the poor guy had to do, tip my hat to him.

[Rallymatt]

It’s only recently that the graves of both men have had the care and dedications appropriate for their achievements. It’s late but absolutely right

[RDS]

10 hours ago, Rallymatt said:

.... My personal proof of the moon landing in ‘68 is the fact ...

I think you will find the moon landing was in 1969, my Dad's birthday actually (21st July)

[Rallymatt]

Don’t you know about the ‘68 landing?  It was a test run to make sure it would all work for TV in ‘69….. 

I realised my mistype after the edit option had passed because the post was held for mod approval. I do remember watching the ‘69 broadcast and having tomato soup and sandwiches which I know Buzz Lightyear had in his pack up for the mission, what with him being the first man to walk on the moon 

[Craig-803583]

I think that Hornby will be running down the stock levels of the A3s ans A4s and changing them over to metal bodies like the duchess has.  Whether they are ready to do that this year or next  I don't know but this is what I suspect they will do.

I think there is also a pressure on decoder supplies.

With the Mk1s they'll have the running numbers swapped every or nearly every year especially at the beginning.  remember the numbers prefixed with region letters and people tend to be fussy.

Same situation with the brake vans, I've got the first one and I'll pickup a second once they renumber them.

Edited July 13 by Craig-803583

[david_watts1]

Metal bodies on locos is almost a must to add weight. They do need to alter running numbers on new production runs to keep sales going. Decoders do need to be smaller with sound and a small ammount of 'stay alive' for bluetooth connectivity.

[Skelton Junction]

8 hours ago, RDS said:

I think you will find the moon landing was in 1969, my Dad's birthday actually (21st July)

We’d got our very first colour tv that week especially for the occasion and then the footage was in black and white. 

[Hobby11]

21 hours ago, Rallymatt said:

Maybe I am biased but, I think the battle between the big 4 (well 3) to claim the speed record and the real stories is one of the epic tales that would make a great film. For its era, it was like going to the moon! And they made a few films about that 😁

The LMS had it's own wind tunnel at Derby and models of the streamlined Coronation Class (Duchess) were tested in it! It's interesting how different the streamlining is, but I suspect, looking at the shapes of modern cars, that the LMS had it right. It's unfortunate that the LMS, or, for that matter, the DRG didn't have a suitable stretch of line to run their locos flat out, I suspect the DRG class 05 (which also has similar streamlined shape to the Coronation) would have been the winner, after all it did 125mph on the flat unlike the other two!

Edited July 13 by Hobby11

[Rallymatt]

Understanding of Fluid Dynamics has come on a long way and although the Coronation looks like it’s the better shape in working as a complete system the A4 is more efficient. The sections on the footplates reduce lateral turbulence caused by running gear/undercarriage. The A4 is thus able to maintain a more stable laminar flow across the bodywork of the rest of the train, reducing frictional drag. If Mallard had been hauling Coronation coaches with the Beavertail observation car on the end the speed would have been substantially higher. 
It must be said that all the streamlined designs were highly effective and if they had been allowed to develop we could have seen some very high speed steam trains, although the network was already at its limit in UK so it was bragging rights than practicality. 

Edited July 13 by Rallymatt

[dBerriff]

I have never liked the look of the streamlined Coronations although that is entirely subjective and I can accept that the design was more efficient, in terms of wind resistance, than the A4. Stanier does not seem to have been that keen either given his insistence on building 5 un-streamlined locomotives in the initial batch. 

[Rallymatt]

@dBerriff, the Coronation isn’t a more efficient shape, LNER had it right. Something referred to as ‘parasitic drag’ upsets the flow on the Coronation. 😁
 

[dBerriff]

That confirms my subjective prejudice then. 🙂

[Trevor-1284476]

I do find it annoying that models are getting discontinued already when those of us in Australia are still waiting for literally anything else to come out down here. The current offerings seen in stores here are the A1/A3/A4, some of the 08s (that it seems noone wants because they are not HM7000 fitted and are modern liveries), a handful of goods stock and some coaches. With DCC Mallard being discontinued and the BR brake van possibly as well (and the blue 08 gone) that restricts our already restricted offerings even further. General predictions among model shop owners I have talked to is that we likely won't see the Class 50 or Class 66 before Christmas and the stuff that was just released will likely be 15+ months out.