Flashbang

Hi If the track is Hornby then the use of Hornby R8243 surface solinoid motor would be the simplest. Note other makes of surface solinoid motors also can be used and fitted! In addition to these motors you will need wire, ideally in three colours - Typically Red, Green and Black and ideally in 16/0.2mm wire size. Then a suitable power supply. This is usually 16 volts AC at around 1.0Amp but can be DC and here I would use something that provides 19 to 22 volts DC. Next you should use Momentary levers or switches. The Hornby Black R044 lever is ok to use, but not with a CDU (See later). A cheaper option is to use toggle switches which need to be sprung to centre off type, often called (On)-Off-(On) style where the bracketed On cannot remain On when the switches lever is released - It returns to the Off position under internal spring operation. Alternatives are to use two non locking press to make push buttons per point or Stud and Probe selection. I mentioned a CDU = Capacitor Discharge Unit. This little device fits immediately after the power supply for the points and before the first point lever or switch etc. It stores power in its onboard capacitors and when a lever or switch is connected to the point motor it immediately releases that stored energy in a "Beefy" pulse of power, ensuring the point motor receives the best possible power to move the point blades over. It also prevents accidental motor coil burn out should a switch or lever remain On for too long. Normally and in your layouts case only one CDU would be needed. Note though a CDU does not work well with the Hornby R044 Black lever due to the R044 rather old design. But they do work with every other passing contact/momentary point lever or switch. Note Hornby do not make a CDU but there are many available Search for Capacitor Discharge Unit via your search engine on the www.

Hi The PA2 is exactly as Chrissaf describes. It uses mainly Latching outputs for most Functions. if I recall correctly F2 is not latching and is frequently used for Horn or Loco whistle sounds where a Press to play and release will allow a second immediate play when the F2 button is repressed. The rest latch. So for example if F5 is say a Guards whistle you press the F5 and F5 shows on the display the whistle will sound and then stop. Pressing F5 again turns Off that sound function (it does not make the sound play again!) the display will then no longer show F5. But pressing F5 a third time will again play the whistle sound and then F5 needs cancelling by pressing it again.

Hi Have you tried programming via the POM (Programming On Main) option, assuming such is available? i.e. Programme loco on the main track not the programming track. I would remove all other locos first though just as precaution, then if possible try POM programming as the full track voltage and current often overcomes decoders failing to programming when on the programming track and its low current output.

Hi Have you undertaken the following... Cleaned all rail tops. Cleaned all loco pick up wheel rims? These are the most likely causes of poor connection. Next, have you any DC plug-in power connectors or power track sections? If so, flip open their plastic cover(s) with the aid of a small flat blade screwdriver and look inside. If there is a small capacitor connected across the two wire connectors snip it out and remove it and close the cover.

I never made any offer to do anything? Please show exactly where did ! What I very clearly said, was that IMO charging a "Labour fee" is OTT for a private individual carrying out the work and especially as its for an alleged friend and fellow modeller too! RDS in the post above has hit the proverbial nail on the head, exactly! Post Edit to correct typo.

Hi Colin No I'm not missing any point. The OP stated in their last sentence "Is £50 too much, considering the parts and labour?" IMO changing for any Labour is a step too far for a modeller who is not in any business of converting locos, and it was for a friend too! I agree with you that the cost of parts needed which I guesstimate are around £42 (Decoder £20. 8 pin socket £1.50. Light bars for conversion £19. Wire if needed £2) But charging labour? Not in IMO! disappointed

Unsure if you have other DCC items? But if this is your first venture and the set was sold as DC then ensure the supplied track power clip or track power section has the internal capacitor removed for DCC operation. If left in place the capacitor will cause issues. Flip open the cover and snip out the capacitor inside and reseal.

Why would you charge a friend labour? As he is also a fellow modeller and you are not in a business of carrying out conversion work as a retailer or specialist is, then surely you should not be charging anyone labour? If you do so, then IMO it is the sole reason your friend said "No Thanks"! At the end of the day and if it were myself, it would be up to the owner of the loco who may consider to offer "a drink" for the work, but I would not change anyone.

Hi If the "Popping" is occurring under DC running then its probably something mechanical? Turn the loco upside-down and look carefully at left and right hand sides. Do any of the Con rods appear different? Do any wheel wipers not seem to be equal and not rub on the sides of the wheels internal face? All these can lead to a "Popping" sound, otherwise its something internal within the loco that needs investigating.

Hi Have you converted this loco to DCC? If so, have you re wired front and rear lights to allow correct direction of travel operation? Via the F0 selection? White decoder wire feeds front headlights and the red rear lights when going forwards, while the Yellow decoder wire feeds rear white headlight(s) and front red lights while going in reverse. All are connected to the Blue decoder wire, which is Positive to all Function outputs. Hmm..While I was typing my reply above it may now not be applicable? .. Seems you have updated your post.

I seriously doubt any old Tri-ang or Hornby locos such as the R50 draws 100milliamps, it will be far more than that when running. How are you measuring the current? Hornby DCC system are not equipped with any current or rail voltage measuring tools. If you measure rail current for a DC loco you should use a DC Amp meter in series with one rail supply lead on a separate section of track that the DCC system is not connected to and feed these rails from a DC source - DC train controller. Then read the current drawn - Expect it on an older loco to be in the 300ma to 700ma range! The "DC" provided by address zero is not DC its a sort of stretched AC but even that isn't quite correct, so a real DC controller is needed. If your Select is fed from the as supplied 1.0Amp power unit then an older loco may well cause the system to sense an overload occurring. Note the very wise words from Chrissaf re operating a DC loco on DCC even at address number 0 (zero). Even Hornby do not recommended it - See the manual for such wording!

Hi As supplied, new this loco is not DCC Fitted. So you have fitted a Hornby R8249 decoder yourself. Is the decoder or its wiring touching anything when the body is fitted? If the above is proved not to be the cause then I would suggest, that if possible, you remove the decoder and refit the DC operation Blanking Plug then test the loco on pure DC on a separate piece of track that's not connected to the DCC system. If you do not have a DC (analogue) controller then use a new PP3 9volt battery connected across the rails. Note, the loco will not be controllable on a PP3 battery, but it should move forwards or in reverse happily! Does the "Popping" sound occur? If so, check for something that is not in the correct place - Wheel wiper bent. Con rod on one side (or both) bent etc.

Hi DCC is (or should be!) pretty universal and very much the same as analogue DC is. That is a loco fitted with Hornby, Bachmann, Dapol, Zimo or ESU etc decoder will work with any standard NMRA compliant DCC control system. There are a very few exceptions but the above is generally true. Where you may have issues is the the basic Bachmann EZ controller only allows nine DCC address number to be used. So if you have a loco address of say 22 you then cannot operate it on the basic EZ DCC system, as 22 is not an address number obtainable. You would have to use the Hornby DCC to alter that locos address number to within the 1 to 9 range.

Hi Be cautious about putting in any old speaker! The speaker chosen has to have the correct Ohm rating (and wattage if necessary) to match the ESU Loksound decoders output. Connect a speaker that has too low an ohm rating and you seriously risk blowing the amplifier in the decoder! ESU recommend... Impedance 4-8 Ohms, 4 Ohms recommended. What version of firmware is your Select using?? This is shown at initial start up with a series of three two digit numbers. It is the first set to appear that's important. Latest are 1.6 or 2.0 (both are same but the latter one applies the newer 'face lift' Selects). If its anything lower than 1.6 then personally I would contact Hornby Customer Service by email or phone and arrange to have it upgraded. It will cost around £15 plus VAT and your postage costs to get it to Hornby return P & P is included. Post edited to add ESU Impedance recommended ratings. grinning

Hi Just to be sure on this..... Is the loco stalling or is it tripping out the DCC system momentarily? Both of course cause the loco to stop, but the latter is due to something completely different.

Hi Mac. It's Brian not Brain, though actually I don't mind. smile I sure, but unproved, that having a radial Bus pair never decreases the data flow but does allows Bus Terminator filters to be easily fitted onto each end of the DCC Bus pair. As you say, "Size" (wire size) does matter with a DCC Bus pair of wires. sunglasses

Whether the DCC power bus is run as a ring, a radial (end to end) or a star (Centre feed with bus wires radiating from the central place) matters not. It is the size of the bus wire used that really matters. A ring or any other bus wire circuit configuration is used on a DCC layout it will not cause decoders to get confused! IMO a ring, especially on larger layout, is really just a waste of expensive bus wire and not necessary when the bus pair of of the correct wire gauge size. grinning

You only usually have two main Bus wires (the DCC Bus Pair) feed from the DCC Consoles Track output. Onto these two bus wires connect all rails via smaller wire sized Dropper. So in answer, only one bus pair and all tracks connect onto that bus pair. Ensuring all left hand rails connect to the same bus wire and of course all right hand rails to the other bus wire. grinning

Thanks Chrissaf for the URL corrections and active links. grinning

Oh I nearly forgot!!! CAN (Controller Area Network) will operate on wire up to at least 500 Mtrs in length. A read of this free to download MERG book will provide much information... https://www.merg.org.uk/content/ebook and a view of Dave Fenton's video using a CAN network is worthwhile too. Mod message: Above URLs converted to clickable Hyperlinks MERG - Electronics for Beginners Book

The "Concern" is two fold with DCC Bus wiring... A) Bus wire size used MUST be able to handle the maximum current output of the DCC system. Typically 4Amps or more. (DCC at 4Amp is 64 watts of heat/power!) B) Getting fault currents back to the DCC system unhindered, usually caused by too smaller wire size used or too much reliance placed on metal rail joiners and the result is a failure or delay in tripping the system. DCC Bus pair IMO needs as a minimum to be 32/0.2mm flex wire or 1.5mm2 solid (Solid is usually stripped from former mains lighting cable outer sheath). Droppers between Bus and rail can be either 7/0.2mm or 16/0.2mm wire. I would recommend 7/0.2mm be used where plenty of droppers are installed - perhaps one pair per rail section and keeping their length to a maximum of around 350-400mm bus to rail. Increasing the Dropper wire size to 16/0.2mm allows longer dropper wire length (approx. 500mm) and if wished less frequent droppers installed. Reliance on metal rail joiners (metal fishplates) passing power and data is really the weak link in the connection chain. The most serious check a DCC user can undertake is the 'Coin across the rails' test carried out at several places around the layout. This is to ensure the DCC system trips out as it should do with each dab of the coin across the rails. Any failure to trip or delayed/slow tripping needs urgent attention as to why the failure is occurring and quickly correcting. But of course there will always be someone who says "Well my layout works with xxxxx" Replace xxxxx with Bell wire, Telephone wire, Wet string etc. But the text I've placed above is best practice and a proven means of ensuring all is correct. Remember, it can never hurt a circuit by having too larger wire size, but undersize wire can and will probably lead to issues at some stage! For a simple train set forget all the above. Just plug the DCC console into the track connector and play. For those who want a more permanent model railway or those who have a larger permanent layout, then whenever possible follow Best Practice! :-)

Hi Some things to be aware of.... Peco Streamline (SL prefixed items) are to a much larger footprint than Peco ST or standard Hornby points. They are also to a larger radius turnout. Only the Hornby Express points are near in radius to the SL Small radius turnout. Medium and large are far greater. Also the natural track centres of two SL points when used a s a cross-over pair is 50mm while on ST or Hornby it is 67mm, so additional pieces of track may be needed in between two SL points to space them wider to match Hornby or ST track centres. Next there are three types of SL point. SL-nnn are Insulated frog - same as Hornby ones are. SL-Ennn Electrofrog - exactly the same size as Insulated frog range, but with all metal frog area. Finally is the SL-Unnn are Unifrog points, but very few Unifrog points are available currently in Code 100 rail profile, but no doubt the range will grow as time progresses. These offer both Insulated frog or Electro frog options in the one point. If you install a SL-E points which give improved running over the point, then you (especially on a DCC layout) need to add two Insulated Rail Joiners (IRJs) the the points Vee rail ends then add new rail feeds after the IRJs to maintain DCC continual rail power.

I was given as a retirement gift a Fluke 187 True reading RMS multimeter, which has as I understand has a sampling rate of up to 10KHz and it measures DCC voltage correctly on its AC range. I also have a lower quality Fluke 87 which on DCC is not quite as accurate but nearly so. I addition have three 'cheap' "Chinese" True RMS multimeters and none of those measure DCC rail volts correctly! Unfortunately, my Fluke 187 has now an internal defect and I contacted Fluke UK last year to ask about a repair? "No repairs available for a meter that old" (its about 14 years old!) . But we can offer you a new version replacement for 50% off the list price as a swap.. Cost £360 plus VAT! Fluke UK said. I politely declined and left that one on their shelves.

No none what so ever, other than you not realising the speed increase is far more dramatic in 28 steps than 128 and crashing the loco persevere

Hi You cannot connect 10 LEDs is series and expect them to work on 12v DC Note:12V DC and NOT 16V AC. In fact it's unlikely the 12v DC from a train set controller will actually be 12 volts! Often under no or little load the supply is around 18/19v and at maximum load down to 11 ish volts possibly! Hence the recommendation to use instead a Regulated DC power supply such as sold for CCTV or LED illumination. Regulated means the voltage remains constant at the required level regardless of load. At 12 Volts DC a white LED can be operated and consume around 10 milliamps with a 1K (1000 Ohm) 1/4watt series resistor per LED. If your DC train controller is used it will almost certainly output a much higher DC voltage than the specified nominal 12v. Plus of course it can be reversed which will stop the LEDs illuminating! The use of such a supply is IMO not at all recommended!