Elite bricked

[PeterRowney]

Hi folks.
Frustrated modeller from Australia here.

I purchased a Hornby Elite unit about 6 years ago from a trade show here in Australia. ($500)
It was working fine, and I had it working with Railmaster software.

Anyway I tried to update the firmware and it not only failed to update, but has turned my ELite into a useless brick :-(

I have read extensively, the thread here and elsewhere about how to update the firmware.
I know how to start the Elite in update mode.
I know how to run the update file in administrator mode.
I know to try the different options (1,2 and 3) for "PC type"

Absolutely nothing works.

After many, many hours of trying, it always says "update fail" at the end of the process.

I am using Windows 7 professional, on a newish laptop.

Please if there is anybody on this forum who can help me recover this $500 controller I would be eternally grateful.

[96RAF]

You appear to have a handle on all the steps Peter, so I won’t insult you by repeating the instructions.

All I can suggest is try it again. Is there any chance you could try it on a different pc/laptop. Maybe a different USB cable or port on the same machine.

Just of interest how long does the failed update appear to take (i.e. progress bar time) before it reports ‘failed’. A good update takes between 2-5 minutes, longer is no problem, but less than 2 is usually a definite fail.

The reason for the selection of Type 1, 2 or 3 is to alter the rate at which the data is fed during the update, e.g. word by word, line by line or page by page, essentially to throttle the pc used to match the Elite.

There has been one report over the years of an Elite actually failing during an update, with no recovery possible, but this is extremely unusual. It is thought a latent fault in the core chip is invoked by the update but so far no one has proven the theory down to which cmponent is affected.

Rob

[2e0dtoeric]

And with respect - Don't try to rush it, or skip any steps.

If the instructions call for 'button A' to be pressed and held for 36.5 seconds, make sure you do!  :-)

Ensure that the Elite is plugged DIRECTLY into a usb on the pc, not into a hub, powered or not.

Is your pc hard-wired to the modem, or are you connected via wifi? If wifi, you could be dropping signal momentarily.

Is your home broadband signal stable or noisy?

Try deleting, and re-downloading the update, in case THAT has been corrupted.

Good luck.

[Chrissaf]

If you have access to a really old PC / Laptop running Windows XP. Perhaps something that has been stuck in a drawer for many years. If not you, then ask around your friends and family. It is known that sometimes, it takes a PC running XP to unbrick an Elite. If you do find a suitable XP PC, then remember that you will have to install the original Hornby driver (not the Microsoft USB Serial one). The original Hornby driver is included in the Elite 1.44 ZIP file that you download from the Hornby site.

[PeterRowney]

Thanks so much for the replies guys.to answer a few of your questions, yes I've now tried the update using three different computers.A Win7 laptop, a Win10 PC, and last jight I tried it with a Win XP laptop.With all these computers I have run the file as administrator, I have tried all the 3 options for PC type.I am assuming that the Elite IS in update mode because in most cases the update appears to be working. It never goes quickly, and usually takes more than 2-3 minutes to complete.The outcome is ALWAYS the same. "Update Fail".I estimate that I have attempted this update over one hundred times now. (Possibly more than pidder?)I spent several days trying different things when the unit first crashed about 3 years ago.I have now spent an entire day (almost 8 hours), of trying every single trick I could find on these pages.Some of these threads I have read twice."If you do find a suitable XP PC, then remember that you will have to install the original Hornby driver "I will now try this with the XP laptop and see what happens.A final question, does the computer need to be connected to the internet for the update to work?Mine is (wifi, but I did also try a network cable. made no difference)

[PeterRowney]

I have also tried different USB ports.Different cables.Three different operating systems.

[Chrissaf]

....does the computer need to be connected to the internet for the update to work?

.

No

.

To load the official Hornby Elite driver into the XP laptop. Use Windows Device Manager to access the current driver and use the 'update driver' feature to navigate to the Elite driver file extracted from the 1.44 ZIP file. If you get a message along the lines of the current driver is newer, then you will have to delete the current driver by actually deleting the driver file on the PC. Device Manager gives a check box for this as part of the 'uninstall' driver process. If you don't DELETE the actual file, Windows will ignore your wishes and just re-install it again.

.

If the Elite is NOT in the 'update mode' the updater software does give an error message fairly early on in the update process and won't get as far as seeing the progress bar. Off hand, I can't remember what the error message says, but nothing you have said in your posts so far, sounds like it.

[PeterRowney]

Ok, with XP i am having even more problems.Am getting error message IOexception Error in Eilte CommThat's using the driver you mentioned that comes with the update.

[Chrissaf]

Ah !.....that is the error message I couldn't remember the text of in my last reply. That message means that the Elite is not correctly in its 'update mode'. Of course, it could be possible that it won't go into 'update mode' if there is a genuine hardware fault.

.

I know you said you have followed all the instructions you have found made by others. But here is a link to mine. It was however written for Win 7 to 10, but the putting the Elite in 'update mode' process is common to ALL Windows versions. It was also written for version 1.43, but this is the same process as 1.44 as well. My post is the 6th one down on the page.

.

https://www.hornby.com/uk-en/forum/running-the-eureka-3801-on-the-elite/?p=1

.

If you go back to Rob's (RAF96) post further up this page. Go to his signature panel and you will find a link to his website. On his site you will find earlier versions of the Elite firmware you can download. I suggest downloading version 1.41. This version was specifically written for the XP driver. If you can get this one to install to unbrick your Elite, that will be a bit like performing a factory reset. Then you can try the 1.44 update again from a clean slate. If the 1.41 update won't install under Win XP either, then your Elite is well and truly bricked.

.

PS - The 1.41 firmware updater has a different user interface and does not give you the PC Type 1 - PC Type 3 choice. If the 1.41 version won't install under Windows XP, it certainly won't install with a later Windows version either. Or if it did, it would be miracle and I would have to change my view in believing in a God.

 

[PeterRowney]

Thanks Chris.

 

I'm still trying on the XP machine but with no luck.

 

I will check to see that I have deleted the driver file correctly and try again :-)

 

[Chrissaf]

Bumping post in case you didn't see my last minute edit in my last reply.

[PeterRowney]

Bumping post in case you didn't see my last minute edit in my last reply.

I've actually tried ALL those old update files including 1.1, 1.3, 1.4,1.44

 

I have managed to get the XP machine to start the update process (so I know the elite is in update mode)

 

But still getting the final "update fail" message.

 

I have been unable to find the option you mentioned to delete the driver file compoletely from XP.

 

When I uninstall the driver in device manager it doesn't give me the option you mentioned to delete the file.

[PeterRowney]

" If the 1.41 update won't install under Win XP either, then your Elite is well and truly bricked."

 

This is my biggest fear now.

 

 

[Chrissaf]

The PC I am writing this on does not have the Elite driver loaded on it, so I can't provide a screen shot. However, if you 'right click' the current Elite driver in Device Manager, then click 'Properties' then the 'Driver Tab' followed by the 'Driver Details' button. This should tell you the driver file name(s) and folder location, where you could manually delete it (I would change its extension from .SYS to .OLD rather than delete, so you could re-instate it if required). Manual file deletion (renaming) can be done, but Windows may protest about it. If it just won't let you delete (rename) it. Then you may have to resort to starting Windows in 'Safe Mode' (or boot into the DOS prompt if you know your DOS commands), then you should be able to delete (rename) it without Windows protesting.

.

PS - The Elite XP Driver will show "R8214 Hornby Elite" in Windows Device Manager. If it says "USB Serial Port (ComX)" where X is a number, then this is the Microsoft driver for the Elite and shouldn't be used on Windows XP, but should be used on Windows 7, 8 & 10.

.

It's possible that the 'Delete File' checkbox is only in later versions of Windows. It's a long time since I ran XP.

[PeterRowney]

Absolutely no luck deleting the file (which was called usbser.sys)

 

I am losing the will to continue here. 

 

Far too many hours of my life have been spent reading these threads, holding buttons for 15 secs, downloading files, borrowing computers. 

 

My trainset is unusable.

My Railmaster software is unusable.

I can not afford another $500 for a new Eilte unit.

 

And not one person from Hornby in AUstralia or the UK has responded to my emails.

 

I appreciate the help you guys have offered but I feel this is just making me angry now :-(

 

[Fishmanoz]

I know you said you are in Oz Peter but I suggest the last resort is Hornby Customer Care. Ring them and ask to speak to the manager Mark Lodge. If not there, ask them to have him call you back, he will. 

 

Most likely is he says return it to them them which will cost you. And we know they don’t do component level repairs so it’s a long shot they can help. But it is the last resort. 

 

PS.  Can you stop using the blue button to reply and go to the bottom of the page to the text box and green reply button pls.  

[Chrissaf]

You might be able to pick up a cheap eLink interface on ebay second hand. Lots of owners sell the eLink on when they upgrade to the Elite. The eLink would allow you to continue to use RailMaster, but does not have any capability for stand alone control as it does not have any knobs or buttons or LCD display.

.

PS - The elink comes with a 1 AMP power supply, but your existing Elite 4 AMP power supply is the official Hornby upgrade supply for the eLink and it will benefit from the extra current (power) available.

[PeterRowney]

"PS.  Can you stop using the blue button to reply and go to the bottom of the page to the text box and green reply button pls. "ooops sorry.

[PeterRowney]

Those following this thread may be interested to read the advice I finally received from Hornby UK.Notice he suggests waiting 30 seconds! not 15 for each step.Then he suggests of that doesn;t work to attempt to update without waiting at all during each step.About to try it now and see what happens.

Dear Sir, Thank you for your email, Please try the following steps yourself -  1) Hold down STOP button.2) Plug power cable in.3) Keep STOP button held for 30 seconds.4) Release STOP button. Wait 30 seconds.5) Plug in USB cable.6) Launch Elite update, and try to update.

 

IF this does not work, or an Error message comes up:

 

1) Pull both cables from Elite.2) Straight away, hold STOP button down, and plug power cable in.3) Do NOT wait 30 seconds, release STOP button once power cable is in.4) Do NOT wait 30 seconds, plug USB cable in straight away.5) Re-try update.

 

This should cure your problem. If you have any issues with this, please come back to us. Kind Regards, Matt Jordan Customer Care Advisor

[96RAF]

As a trial I deliberately bricked my test box Elite by pulling the power and USB cables during an update. No response at normal start after that.

 

Following the second suggested method...

I held the Stop button down until I had plugged in the power, immediately releasing it and plugging in the USB cable (Win 10 64 bit i5 machine front USB 3.0 port), followed immediately by launch of v1.44 update.

I picked Com 6  (noted in device manager earlier) and selected PC Type 2, then download.

3 minutes later the update had installed OK.

 

So I did it again, twice more, rushing the connections as quickly as I could and each time the update worked.

 

I was surprised it worked as the PC was still bonging about the USB connection when I hit go on the update .exe file.

Rob

[96RAF]

Even more surprising is the above was carried out using a Select 1-amp power supply, which was the only one handy.

Sometimes a good Elite will not boot on this supply.

Rob

[PeterRowney]

Well unfortunately for me, it has failed to work yet again.Following the instructions to the letter I could get the update to work, but always with the same final result."Update fail"This was on a Win7 machine.Not sure what else to try.Having absolutely no luck sourcing an elink unit 2nd hand.

[RDS]

Peter, presumably you will re-contact Hornby as suggested in the last sentence of the communication you received from them.

[john205480]

I managed to buy a used Elite from ebay for less than a 3rd of the new price to use with my second layout .It worked fine . I suggest you shop around for a used one at far less than AU$500 .I worked in IT for 22 years and sometimes the only solution is to replace the unit rather than drive yourself insane trying things over and over .Win XP is obsolete and no longer supported by Microsoft . Good luck 

[pidder]

Peter  I have an unused elink you are welcome to, freebie,  just the unit, presume you have your power supply and USB cables. ask the Moderator to email me your address.