Stephen-1260829 Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 I have just been running my DCC fitted TT120 blue/yellow HST 125s. I have noticed that both units carry the same class number 254 004 on the front. Surely they should have different running numbers?? Doe anyone else have two traction units with the same number? the E numbers on the side are different (E43062 / E43063) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moccasin Posted March 21 Share Posted March 21 (edited) When first introduced, HSTs had a set number starting either 253 or 254 - they were more like multiple units in that regard. These were soon abandoned but this is correct for HSTs when first introduced, as depicted by the models In fact, you’ll note that these HSTs are missing their baffles above/behind the cab. These are present on the exec & GWR liveried sets that Hornby have released. I understand that these baffles were introduced as an upgrade to deal with issues with the locomotives when first entering service. Edited March 21 by Moccasin Clarity 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Generic Hornby Username Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Moccasin is exactly right. The early HSTs shouldn't be thought of as individual locomotives, but one complete train. The entire train was known as 254004. Within the train were power cars 43062 and 43063 along with the coaches. But the entire train was known as 254004. You can see a picture of 254004 here: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/362624838239?mkevt=1&mkcid=1&mkrid=710-53481-19255-0&campid=5338722076&customid=&toolid=10050 4 hours ago, Moccasin said: When first introduced, HSTs had a set number starting either 253 or 254 - they were more like multiple units in that regard. These were soon abandoned but this is correct for HSTs when first introduced, as depicted by the models In fact, you’ll note that these HSTs are missing their baffles above/behind the cab. These are present on the exec & GWR liveried sets that Hornby have released. I understand that these baffles were introduced as an upgrade to deal with issues with the locomotives when first entering service. Don't bring up those exhaust deflectors- they're a sore subject! From the research I've done, every HST should have had the exhaust deflectors installed by 1981. That places the power cars in their original 1970s state. Hornby should have shipped them with the baffles in order to match the coaches which are in the post 1980 livery (with TRUB, TGS, and "125" added to the coaches). Bit of a small mistake. It's a near miss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Fox 17 Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Most, if not all, Southern EMU's had the same unit number on cab front at each end still had individual coach numbers. They even had sets of Bulleid and Maunsell coaches set in 3, 4, 5 and 6 coach rakes given a set number on either end. I am fairly certain the Sprinter units we built at York also had unit numbers allocated on the front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moccasin Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 17 minutes ago, Silver Fox 17 said: Most, if not all, Southern EMU's had the same unit number on cab front at each end still had individual coach numbers. They even had sets of Bulleid and Maunsell coaches set in 3, 4, 5 and 6 coach rakes given a set number on either end. I am fairly certain the Sprinter units we built at York also had unit numbers allocated on the front. Yes I think it’s when they realised that HSTs wouldn’t stay in a single fixed formation that they removed the 253/254 classification. The coaching rakes were semi-permanently coupled together but the power cars were interchangeable. With reliability issues in their early years, the power cars needed to be swapped to keep fleet availability at sufficient levels. Multiple units now all have class and unit number shown on the front, like the excellent Sprinters, and very rarely change composition. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rallymatt Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Initially HST was classified as a Diesel Multiple Unit by BR, 234 (WR 7 car sets) 235 (ER 8 car sets) As Moccasin says, although they were intended to stay as sets they soon get mixed up and even region prefix letters on coach stock were dropped. BR later reclassified HST sets as locomotives and coach sets. A childhood disappointment for me was my OO HST was Western Region 234, hailing from the wrong side of the Pennines, good to see Hornby got this right in TT. The roof hoods would be a nice accessory pack detail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postman On The Rails Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 44 minutes ago, Rallymatt said: Initially HST was classified as a Diesel Multiple Unit by BR, 234 (WR 7 car sets) 235 (ER 8 car sets) As Moccasin says, although they were intended to stay as sets they soon get mixed up and even region prefix letters on coach stock were dropped. BR later reclassified HST sets as locomotives and coach sets. A childhood disappointment for me was my OO HST was Western Region 234, hailing from the wrong side of the Pennines, good to see Hornby got this right in TT. The roof hoods would be a nice accessory pack detail. The question here is what do you call the wrong side of the Pennines lol 😝 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moccasin Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 16 minutes ago, Postman On The Rails said: The question here is what do you call the wrong side of the Pennines lol 😝 The side where roses are red and the rain falls constantly 😜 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postman On The Rails Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 1 minute ago, Moccasin said: The side where roses are red and the rain falls constantly 😜 Now to me that’s the wrong side 😝 and yep every time I been Manchester it’s rained lol White Rose it the correct side lol 😝 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
96RAF Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 I have a handy little book about HSTs telling of the set numbers versus unit numbers pre-post messing around. If anyone has a particular query I can dig it out and refer. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moccasin Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 On a related note, I recall a holiday in London in my youth when I first tried train spotting. All the southern EMUs had set numbers on the front that didn’t appear to match those in the Platform 5 or Ian Allan book I’d been bought. It was a very frustrating day if I recall. This would probably have been around 1980 (showing my age). I agree with @Rallymatt that baffles in the accessory pack would have been a nice touch. Maybe someone will produce some with a 3D printer…. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rallymatt Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 44 minutes ago, Postman On The Rails said: The question here is what do you call the wrong side of the Pennines lol 😝 Everyone knows the Right side is Right.. White Rose indicates the correct side of Pennines, Red is danger… 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr2002 Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 2 hours ago, Rallymatt said: Initially HST was classified as a Diesel Multiple Unit by BR, 234 (WR 7 car sets) 235 (ER 8 car sets) . . . A childhood disappointment for me was my OO HST was Western Region 234, hailing from the wrong side of the Pennines Class 253 (WR) and class 254 (ER). I think your biggest disappointment should have been the far-too-short coaches, with the wrong number of windows . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rallymatt Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Yes, absolutely on the numbers… ahh the short MK3s with a window less was a classic, they worked on the tight corners though… flat out🤣 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postman On The Rails Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 2 hours ago, Moccasin said: On a related note, I recall a holiday in London in my youth when I first tried train spotting. All the southern EMUs had set numbers on the front that didn’t appear to match those in the Platform 5 or Ian Allan book I’d been bought. It was a very frustrating day if I recall. This would probably have been around 1980 (showing my age). I agree with @Rallymatt that baffles in the accessory pack would have been a nice touch. Maybe someone will produce some with a 3D printer…. I believe @GMD is good at that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Irishmail Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 3 hours ago, Moccasin said: The side where roses are red and the rain falls constantly 😜 You should be in the west of Ireland if you want rain lol .... 🙂 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postman On The Rails Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Just now, Irishmail said: You should be in the west of Ireland if you want rain lol .... 🙂 Least you have nice countryside to enjoy 😊 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodge1965 Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 11 minutes ago, Irishmail said: You should be in the west of Ireland if you want rain lol .... 🙂 Isn't that what Wales is for?? Rain... 😎 Everytime i have been there and then lived there, it rained and rained. Couldn't wait to move from there. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postman On The Rails Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 9 minutes ago, Dodge1965 said: Isn't that what Wales is for?? Rain... 😎 Everytime i have been there and then lived there, it rained and rained. Couldn't wait to move from there. That was the Lake District for me whenever I went there was also horrible weather still enjoyed though 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dodge1965 Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 Just now, Postman On The Rails said: That was the Lake District for me whenever I went there was also horrible weather still enjoyed though I loved the motorbike rides, but hated the rain and getting wet and always cleaning the bikes.. But scenery was to die for.. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephen-1260829 Posted March 22 Author Share Posted March 22 Thanks for letting me know about the running numbers. for a while I thought that the factory had put two power car bodies in the train pack. I will also need to find out about the headlight configuration 2/1. I am assuming that there will be correct way to show the headlights. this was never a problem with my OO HST train set (with one coach) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMD Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 2 hours ago, Postman On The Rails said: I believe @GMD is good at that Flattered to be mentioned here chaps - but I suspect my machine is not going to cut it for this - it's just a basic FDM. Fine for coal loads and things like that but I doubt very much it would be sharp enough for baffles. If someone points me in the right direction I'm happy to give it a go, but don't expect much! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Postman On The Rails Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 16 minutes ago, GMD said: Flattered to be mentioned here chaps - but I suspect my machine is not going to cut it for this - it's just a basic FDM. Fine for coal loads and things like that but I doubt very much it would be sharp enough for baffles. If someone points me in the right direction I'm happy to give it a go, but don't expect much! You are more advanced than me I wouldn’t know where to even start 😛 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rallymatt Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 I have enough trouble with a paper printer! ‘Printing Objects’ is pure Black Magic… well a grey resin coloured magic 😁 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz657 Posted March 22 Share Posted March 22 (edited) I've got a resin printer but no good with designing. Re-scaling and combining kit pieces downloaded files to 3D print as one are about the most creative I get 🤩 Edited March 22 by Baz657 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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