Have you found yourself telling folks that a 'Train' is not a 'Train'!!! 🤔

[JJ73]

Have you heard folk looking at a Locomotive & saying "Oh that a nice Train" - WROOOONG!!! A Train is only when a Locomotive is pulling / connected to Rolling Stock (I.e. - Wagons and / or Carriages!!!) & not when it is on it's own - It's just a Loco on it's own!!! How many times have you said that to folks??? 🤔🚂

[What About The Bee]

Well ... never. 

They may not know the difference, but they are excited to see the locomotive.  

We want to be ambassadors for the hobby JJ.  So gently educate them instead of correcting them.  

Say "That really is a cool locomotive.  It is an X".  They will immediately see that the part they called a train has a special name, a locomotive.   They will see that you have knowledge and they can talk to you about it.

Or, you can bellow out "WROONG!  You don't know anything".  They will think you unkind and not want to talk to you about the locomotive.

Which do you think is better?

Bee

[LTSR_NSE]

Erm… What about a diesel or electric powered railway vehicle that is approximately the size of a railway coach & carries either passengers or parcels by itself?

Also a multiple unit is definitely a train even though it has no separate locomotive.

It is good to tread the line between knowledge and arrogance carefully, unless you genuinely have no interest in other humans!

[JJ73]

Well I do try to 'educate them' Bee - just so they know for the future & they do remember when I said about it for the second time & they are like 'ar yes I remember you saying that the last time...'

 

Well D. M. U's. & E. M. U. are different - I was generally talking about either Steam Locos or Diesel Locos!!! 🚂

[What About The Bee]

Just remember JJ, a person can not know everything.  It simply isn't possible.  

So if a person doesn't know that a locomotive isn't a train, it just means they do not know the name.  It doesn't mean they are smart or stupid, at all.  It just means they don't know the name.  And that's okay

Be kind JJ. 

Bee

[Paul-380474]

I have trouble enough using the correct terminology myself. I called an engine a 'train' all of my childhood life, and having run a school railway for 24 years where the participants (aged 10-11) all called their particular engines 'trains' I would have to refer to their 'train' to be understood. Even now, should I be saying 'Engine', or 'Locomotive'? Personally, if I am understood, then ... who cares!

[Skelton Junction]

See also:

Train Station

or

Railway Station 

[dBerriff]

Then there is engine driver. I suppose we instinctively try to cut down the number of syllables. Loc-o-mot-ive driver - a few milliseconds wasted.

[Bulleidboy]

It's the same with Flying Scotsman. Flying Scotsman is the locomotive - The Flying Scotsman is a "train" that leaves (does it still??) Kings Cross at 10am each day. The number of people who say "I saw the Flying Scotsman last week". 

[Going Spare]

I quote from the sales side of this website: "What is a locomotive for a model railway?  Model locomotives are replicas of full-sized trains."  So there you have it, officially!

[Brew Man]

Hornby Schmornby! What do they know? 🤣

[atom3624]

Must admit, I do cringe each time I see extremely well educated persons getting it wrong.

It's not so much they get it wrong, it's simply they obviously don't care that they get it wrong - this is the 'generation thing'.

Al.

[ModelerXYZ]

Does a locomotive occupy a block section if it is travelling in it alone? Yes. So therefore in signalling terms, it is a train, wether it consists of a light locomotive or a loco hauling 50 waggons. Would it still kill you if you got run over by it? probably. Yes it must be a train. XYZ

[What About The Bee]

4 hours ago, ModelerXYZ said:

Would it still kill you if you got run over by it?

🤣

How to tell if an object is a train?  See if it kills you.  I hereby declare the definitive train test.  

Bee

[ModelerXYZ]

When i volunteer on the local heratige line, I must keep away from the track if a train is coming. A DMU, a Permanat way train and any other movement would flatten me if I was in the way. Would it matter if it was light engine? No, it would still be dangerous if I was there in its way. A pway trolley however probably wouldn't kill you if you were in its way. However it would still block a signalling section. I would not regard a pway trolley as a train as it is human powered and able to stop quickly. XYZ

[LesXRN]

As a retired main line passenger Driver, I will tell you what was in the Drivers Rule book. A light loco is a train. I know it sounds daft, but that's what it says.

 

[96RAF]

8 hours ago, LesXRN said:

As a retired main line passenger Driver, I will tell you what was in the Drivers Rule book. A light loco is a train. I know it sounds daft, but that's what it says.

 

So essentially a train is any controlled unit moving on the railway, regardless of consist.

[atom3624]

That's what they're saying, which does make sense.

I always understood as JJ originally implied - single powered unit is the locomotive which hauls a train, but when combined - loco + train - it equals a train as well.

Al

[What About The Bee]

Makes perfect sense to me.  The railways do not need to know the name of the things on the track, just that there is something there.

Once a block is known occupied (or not), further movements can be permitted 

For the fuel optimization software I worked on, every piece in consist was known, including its mass / load.  Where is was within consist.  The distribution of locomotives within consist, not always just in front, they can be distributed throughout. The track, the weather, in fact, anything that would affect fuel consumption. 

All that was second order.  Safety first.  Is there a high railer there? Because that is a 'train' too.  

÷÷÷

Yet this isn't what @JJ73was talking about.  Different things have commonly accepted different names.  

The intricacies of how a modern railway operates is a different and still excellent topic.  Thank you @LesXRNfor that insider information

Bee

Edited 18 hours ago by What About The Bee

[threelink]

On 04/10/2024 at 11:08, LesXRN said:

As a retired main line passenger Driver, I will tell you what was in the Drivers Rule book. A light loco is a train. I know it sounds daft, but that's what it says.

 

That makes perfect sense. I have a few bits of signal box kit including a block indicator. When the block is occupied the indicator shows "Train on Line ", irrespective of the nature of the occupying consist.